Time to Talk Expansion

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Ron Kessler on April 16, 2009 at 9:10pm

I'm biased, but Denver. I did see a rumor that there was an investor group that was interested in a team for 2011, hope it's true.

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by chevy on April 16, 2009 at 9:10pm

With both Philly and Atlanta due to come into the league next year I think that the league might freeze expansion unless a really strong ownership group comes along. San Diego tried last year and failed and Dallas apparently has failed twice now. I could see the league being satisfied with 9 teams for now. Then making sure they are all going to be in good standing through the benchmark 3rd year when it appears the majority of the contracts with players and sponsors are due to come up for renewal.

But projecting past that I think the most likely 2 markets would be Carolina and the Pacific northwest. I think Carolina is a rich soccer market but the trick is getting a local ownership group there with deep enough pockets. The Pacific northwest I also think is a good market, my only hesitation there is that MLS might oversaturate the market not leaving enough room for a WPS club in one of those cities.

As for the other cities:

San Diego-has too many economic and politcal problems to come together right now.

Dallas-no place to play apparently

Miami/Tampa-the only successfully consist attended sporting events in Florida are the Dolphins games and college football, too much risk

Kansas City- I just don't see happening, it seems like the Wizards have enough problems of their own I don't know how a WPS team would fair.

Montreal-honestly I don't know enough about it to make an honest assessment on.

A few possibles you didn't list:

Toronto-given the success of the MLS club up there

Minneapolis-WUSA had a tour through there in '04 trying to revive the original league, might be a possiblity

Colorado- heard whispers about them possibly trying to get something together, another possibility

Upstate NY- heard a whisper/rumor about them sometime last year. If you place a team in Rochester and try to draw out people from Buffalo and Syracuse to the games, might be workable. But it would take an ownership group with huge pockets.

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by StarCityFan on April 16, 2009 at 10:42pm

I'm not sure I'd like to see any more than 12 teams in a women's league - many more than that, and the talent gets too diluted.

Given that, where should the remaining three teams be located? I'd go with Dallas to cover the southwest and then expand to Canada with a western team in Vancouver and an eastern team in Montreal or Toronto. You could then have a 22-game season with a home-and-home with each team.

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Rod Stoner on April 16, 2009 at 11:57pm

I think 12 teams is to few. I definately think the league and hope the league expands to at least 16 teams in the future. I think that would give a wide market, and provide plenty of oppurtunities for women soccer players. I really do think a 16 team league is very sustainable with talent. There are plenty of talented players still out there in the world and plenty more coming up through the USA ranks. Now I know this will not happen over night but I think with 5 to 7 years a 16 team league would be possible with expansion to Canada. Four cities in Canada that should be looked at heavily in my opinion are Ottawa, Toronto, Montreal, and Vancouver. Then coming back to the states Carolina would be great fit. Look at just the USL W-League there are over 30 teams (http://www.uslsoccer.com/teams/index_E.html ) in that league. Then consider the WPSL that has over 50 teams ( http://www.wpsl.info/teams/ ) and you can see there are plenty of area's out there where teams can come from. This also shows there is a huge demand for women wanting to play on. With that many semi-pro teams out there I really think even 16 teams is low and would think 18 to 21 would be the max you would ever see and at that point is when I would start to worry about a talent problem. Granted this is many years away but hopefully we see this league grow to 12 teams within the next 3 to 5 years at the minimum and that is a very possible future for this league.

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Ron Kessler on April 17, 2009 at 12:19am

Teams are going to go where investors with $$$ are. Even if City X is indisputably the most fertile ground for a team, if there's no local investor then they're going to get a team.

Balancing desire to expand their footprint with maintaining quality of play - I wonder if WPS will ever be in a position to try pro/rel and eventually establish two 12 or 16-team leagues (1st and 2nd division)? The pro/rel thing is debated constantly by MLS fans (though it will never happen), could it actually work better for WPS down the road?

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by StarCityFan on April 17, 2009 at 9:21am

Rod Stoner said:

Look at just the USL W-League there are over 30 teams (http://www.uslsoccer.com/teams/index_E.html ) in that league. Then consider the WPSL that has over 50 teams ( http://www.wpsl.info/teams/ ) and you can see there are plenty of area's out there where teams can come from. This also shows there is a huge demand for women wanting to play on. With that many semi-pro teams out there I really think even 16 teams is low and would think 18 to 21 would be the max you would ever see and at that point is when I would start to worry about a talent problem.

Yes, there are a lot of amateur women's teams, but only a handful of them are any good. I followed the Freedom's W-League team the last few years, and they would regularly get 4-0 and 6-1 results against most of their competition. There were only six or seven teams in the league that were even competitive with the Freedom, and all of those teams have seen their best players drafted into WPS, so the teams this year are going to be even weaker. The really good players that are left are ones like Tobin Heath and Casey Nogueira who are still in college and therefore not eligible for WPS - in fact, a lot of players at this level are college players home for the summer working at staying fit.

Thinking of what's left of the Freedom W-League team post-WPS, there are maybe three players at the most whom I'd even consider for WPS - and the Freedom will be one of the best teams in the league. Most of the opposing teams didn't even have one player at that level. So if we generously assume that there's one player per amateur team of WPS caliber, that's about 80 total, or enough for four more teams, which is pretty much the 12 I'm suggesting is the limit.

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by StarCityFan on April 17, 2009 at 10:01am

carabin said:

Laura and Émilie

If the stadium Saputo was in the USA, Montreal would be in the WPS
But the WPS direction prefer Dallas which even have no soccer stadiums..

We are so otherwise better as Dallas , it seems to me

but we are not regrettably Americans citizens...

As Ron notes above, it's all about the owners. WPS is built on a franchise model, which means the owner is responsible for the team. No owner (with a couple million dollars to throw around), no team. Dallas apparently has someone with the pockets to field a team, just no stadium. If Montreal had someone willing to field a team, odds are they'd have one. But please don't complain about American parochialism until you can point to a Canadian ownership group who wants to field a team but gets snubbed by WPS. At that point, I would heartily agree with you.

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by amers on April 17, 2009 at 10:19am

i feel cary, nc would be a great expansion place since it is like the home or start of womens soccer in america. i agree starcityfan about tobin heath and casey nogueria, i think we could add lauren cheney to that list too. i will be watching all of the unc games this season.

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by StarCityFan on April 17, 2009 at 10:45am

Maude-Nancy dite "protègetibia'' said:

sorry and Vancouver now?
we have a great women team, a public ( 3000 at 4500 people at woman game ) a very professionnal organization ( Vancouver whitecaps), a stadium also....

7 us team + 3 expansion us team + 0 canadian team = a very good deal for canadian people

WHY ????????

Several canadians fans of soccer ask questions...

I am full of admiration for the Vancouver Whitecaps organization, but did they try to join WPS? If they were turned down, then you have a legitimate beef. But operating a professional team is on a whole different scale from operating an amateur, W-League team, even one on the caliber of the Whitecaps. (I've seen the difference myself between last year's W-League Freedom and this year's professional Freedom.) You need millions, maybe even tens of millions, of dollars even to consider it. If no one behind the Whitecaps has that kind of money - and is willing to risk it on a women's soccer team - then they're not going to get a WPS franchise no matter how good the organization or how suitable the stadium is.

Don't get me wrong: I'm wholeheartedly in favor of WPS including Canada and am mildly disappointed they don't already. But until I see evidence of the league snubbing an owner in Canada who wants to field a team, I'm not going to blame them for there not being a Canadian team. Meanwhile, if you want a Canadian team, try to track down some rich Canadian guys interested in women's soccer.

Until then, thanks for all the very talented Canadian players. ;) (I'd like to thank you specifically for Erin McLeod, but I can't do that until she arrives, which hasn't happened yet.)

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by StarCityFan on April 17, 2009 at 10:47am

emilie said:

now i phone President Obama for a meeting with Prime minister Harper for a big soccer happening with full of girls wearing strings in the us-canada competition.

allo , allo President Obama please do you will play soccer with us ?
i am goolkeeper and Laura is a defender, and Maude a centre forward .....

I think the Freedom need to turn Malia and Sasha Obama into women's soccer fans. That would do wonders for WPS! ;)

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Rod Stoner on April 17, 2009 at 11:43am

I don't think personally that there not being a Canadian team in WPS has anything to do with WPS not being open to a team. I personally think the focus in Canada has been solely on the MLS with the ownership groups and the WPS has been overlooked by those owners in the the short term. However, I do believe you will see some interests in the coming years with those clubs in Canada that have acquired MLS franchises. It just seems like a natural progression to me.

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by chevy on April 17, 2009 at 11:54am

Laura said:

I thank the American people for opening the door to a possible expansion in Canada.

And I asked the question of because there are no Canadian clubs in the WPS to Mary Harvey and to commissioner Tonya Antonucci …

Both leaders of WPS filter comments not to have to answer has certain awkward questions of which mine. And they have published me never either the one, or l, the other.

I was surprised that Vancouver didn’t go a WPS franchise, they have the perfect sized stadium, and would have had a good core of quality Canadian players to recruit from.

Why the United States Soccer Federation (USSF) wouldn’t allow it ???

The protectionist of certain influential Americans ???

Canadian money is not good for WPS business ???

Why ???

If I were the commish of WPS the earliest I would consider Vancouver would be 2012. I would want to see what happens to the Whitecaps fan base in 2011 when the MLS team arrives. If the fan base stays solid then I would definitely consider an ownership group from there. If the Whitecaps can't draw half of what they draw now to their games then there would be no room for a WPS team in that market. As for the rest of Canada, if a strong ownership group emerges with a minimal 4000 in attendance projection I would jump all over it.

▶ Reply to This

▶ Reply to This

• ‹ Previous
• 1
• 2
• Next ›
• Page